The God Particle Is an Explanation For Genesis 1:1

by sabastious 220 Replies latest members politics

  • sabastious
    sabastious

    Hello JWN. Over the years I have posted about the existence of God at the moment of the Big Bang. I have taken some major heat for this belief, but nonetheless it has remained my faith. The discovery of the Higgs Boson has provided compelling evidence for my faith and further strengthens it. I can do nothing but thank the scientific community for providing me the tangible information I need to fill in the gaps of my own understanding of the universe.

    54 days before the Higgs Boson discovery was tentatively announced I was involved in a thread discussing this YouTube Video:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z1BzP1wr234

    The video makes the claim that the Christian God watches idly while little kids get murdered and women get raped and refuses to help. This is blasphemy because it's not taking into consideration all factors even though the creators of the video know that they don't have all the information. Such as the confirmation of the Higgs Boson Particle which is refered to as a revolutionary step in the understanding of all matter.

    Renowned Cosmologist Lawrence Krauss, an esteemed colleague of Richard Dawkins, had this to say on the discovery:

    Assuming the particle in question is indeed the Higgs, it validates an unprecedented revolution in our understanding of fundamental physics and brings science closer to dispensing with the need for any supernatural shenanigans all the way back to the beginning of the universe—and perhaps even before the beginning, if there was a before. How the Higgs Boson Posits a New Story of our Creation

    I agree that supernatural shenanigans are not a beneficial force for our world, but the Higgs Boson is not supernatural and provides itself as evidence for the credability of Genesis 1:1's reference to heaven and earth and their interrelationship. In the thread about the YouTube Video I had this to say on the subject:

    My argument is that upon discovering the Bible has a margin for error that simply discarding it as a word of God is without warrant. Instead we are simply required to go back to the begininng of the Bible and reinterpret. That's the beauty of Genesis 1:1 it simply asserts the notion that God exists, was there in the beginning and is the creator of the heavens and the earth. Which typically is what both atheists and modern theists, like myself, do. The atheists conclude Genesis 1:1 to be a farse and theists conclude it to be a universal truth. This creates opposing forces.

    Genesis 1:1 says "God created the heavens and the earth" for a very specific reason. A reason I suspect has evaded most of the atheist community especially the ones with the world take over agendas (it's ok, it's through reason *Dr Evil side-mouth-pinky*). In a very old religion in China called Confucianism they tell a tale of a Dragon-Horse emerging from a Yellow River with strange symbols painted on it's armor that are now called the 8 Trigrams in Eastern religions. They are called Trigrams because they were simlply a tri-grouping arrangement of two symbols: a solid line and a broken line. Three solid lines in a row is grouped and called the Heaven Trigram and three broken lines in a row is called the Earth Trigram.

    So, what is being described in Genesis 1:1? I do not believe it's speaking about a literal heavens (like what we see with telescopes) or even a literal earth. I think it was speaking about the stages of their Trigram counterparts: Creative and Receptive. If you swapped these stage words temporarily with the words used in Genesis 1:1 you get "In the beginning God created the creative and the receptive." This is a rough linguistic way to explain what the "beginning" even means. It means the beginning of creation, not just the beginning of the universe. For atheists when they see the word "beginning" their minds automatically jumps to the big bang for reasons of an empirical nature. This is because they have already chose to reject Genesis 1:1 as legitimate for reasons that were likely already considered by the writers of Genesis 1:1. This is their right, but to assume that the writers of the Torah, a book of law, that Zid so eloquently points out caused the death of so many, did not give consideration to atheism before writing Genesis 1:1 is simply wrong and absurd. They did consider it and they chose the same path that I choose. We chose to believe in God as the creator of the creative process. When the Torah explains God as "I AM" it means something entirely different to you than it does to me. When the Moses character tries to trap the Creator himself into giving a name he give a cryptic response. Why? It's because it's not as cut and dry as that and neither is Genesis 1:1.

    So, when you continue reading through Genesis once you have legitimately gotten past Genesis 1:1 (without rejection), which I contend you actually have not gotten past it yet because of preconcieved notions, you will see it's talking about the creative process rather than the events that followed the big bang, which is the beginning of our known universe. - post #8377

    What many atheists do along with Dr Krauss is ignore the methodology that was used to create the Torah. They do this because the methodology was not preserved only the product was so the scientific method stalls.

    Dr Michio Kaku just put out a new video on BigThink which talks about the God particle and why it's an explanation for Genesis 1:1.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gCnvuKb0T7E

    He says that that Genesis claims "God put the universe into motion" which is exactly what the Higgs Boson Class of particles played a part in doing, if not is the sole force that set the universe into motion. Now, this discovery is NOT scientific evidence for the existence of God, but it is a unified theory of everything as in everything that has mass is given that by these particular particles.

    Faith is not something that is blind that's what the Watchtower taught us all and it's a lie. Something doesn't just spring forth from nothing, there has to be something to work with in the first place. In the beggning there was a Force, and that Force broke symmetry. Was it God? I believe so.

    Symmetry breaking in physics describes a phenomenon where (infinitesimally) small fluctuations acting on a system which is crossing a critical point decide the system's fate, by determining which branch of a bifurcation is taken. To an outside observer unaware of the fluctuations (or "noise"), the choice will appear arbitrary. This process is called symmetry "breaking", because such transitions usually bring the system from a disorderly state into one of two definite states. Symmetry breaking is supposed to play a major role in pattern formation.

    -Sab

  • Londo111
    Londo111

    Very philosophical, Sab!

    I'm still trying to wrap my head around how the Higgs mechanism imparts mass to different particles. What I find fascinating is that it is a tachyon condensate that fills spacetime. I have wondered the relationship between the Higgs and the invariance of C, and the relationship of the Higgs field to spacetime itself.

    In essence, what quantum mechanics has shown, especially in regard to the Higgs field, is that there is no true void. There is no such thing as nothing.

  • Christ Alone
    Christ Alone

    Wow, Sab...that video was fascinating.

    I'll have to look into it more!

  • oldlightnewshite
    oldlightnewshite

    Sab,

    You should take a look at the penultimate episode of Horizon (BBC) on torrents. titled 'How small is the universe?' Scientists use the info from our analysis of the nanoworld to predict the size of the universe. You would get a kick out of it.

  • Twitch
    Twitch

    This oughta be good...

  • EntirelyPossible
    EntirelyPossible

    The God Particle Is an Explanation For Genesis 1:1

    That is in absolutely no way true.

    The video makes the claim that the Christian God watches idly while little kids get murdered and women get raped and refuses to help.

    It's not blasphemy because the Christian God is not real.

    I agree that supernatural shenanigans are not a beneficial force for our world, but the Higgs Boson is not supernatural and provides itself as evidence for the credability of Genesis 1:1's reference to heaven and earth and their interrelationship

    Bingo. The Higgs-Boson is NOT supernatural and thus is NOT an explanation for what is, a supernatural event. I know that's not what you meant, but when you decide to try to intermingle science and a mish-mash of unfathomable and largely unexplainable and indefensible religion, the breaks tend to not fall your way.

    What many atheists do along with Dr Krauss is ignore the methodology that was used to create the Torah. They do this because the methodology was not preserved only the product was so the scientific method stalls.

    Sciene again does not break your way. You can't claim the method was not preserved and then claim people don't understand it. What it is not understandable are the parts that you claim exist that don't, like saying it talks about genetics. Again, that is made up. Forensic, textual and other sciences are reconstructing how to came to be quite nicely. Those sciences are NOT proving your claims.

    Now, this discovery is NOT scientific evidence for the existence of God, but it is a unified theory of everything as in everything that has mass is given that by these particular particles.

    No it isn't. A unified theory of particle physics, quantum mechanics and relativity has yet to be acheived. Science again breaks against the stuff you are making up and trying to pass off as truth.

    Something doesn't just spring forth from nothing, there has to be something to work with in the first place. In the beggning there was a Force, and that Force broke symmetry. Was it God? I believe so.

    It wasn't nothing, it was Nothing. You should read the very scientist you deride, Lawrence Krause, for a more detailed explanation.

    Seriously, please stop peddling your mashup of genetics in the Torah, worshipping a God that, as you do, condones slavery, encourages and threatens violence, the I-Ching, your utter incomprehension of science and whatever else of bubbling up in your head and passing it off as truth. It, at best, only makes you look, rightly, like you have absolutely NO idea what you are talking about and at worse, might influence someone else to buy into the claptrap snake oil.

    Jesus is asking you, as a champion of truth, to knock it off. You're giving him a bad name.

  • tec
    tec

    What i love about the science (especialy new scientific discoveries, hypothesis, possibilities) of anything really, is that they are not in conflict with God, the Father of Christ and creation. (or understanding of one or the other are often in conflict, mind you) Scientific discoveries, imo, are just on the brink (and probably won't get farther than that in our lifetimes) of showing the reality of some things taken on faith right now. I'm not sure that this will change anything for some, though.

    Peace,

    tammy

  • King Solomon
    King Solomon

    Yup, what EP said. Biggs particle has NOTHING to do with "replacing the role of God" in creation, but was simply named "the God particle" when one of the particle physicists kept referring to the "God-damned particle", and that got shortened to the God particle by the press.

    Sab, L Ron Hubbard already did the dianetics thing to blend science with religion, but he had a background as a sci-fi writer so he wrote a plot-line. There's plenty of good reasons not to believe in God, but thinking meta-physical sausage-making is the way is simply you falling for (yet) another hoax, like an internet Nigerian scam, or maybe trying to create one? I dunno...

    TEC said:

    What i love about the science (especialy new scientific discoveries, hypothesis, possibilities) of anything really, is that they are not in conflict with God, the Father of Christ and creation. (or understanding of one or the other are often in conflict, mind you)

    And only someone who is COMPLETELY ignorant of the principles of science could make such a bald-faced delusional statement with a straight face...

    Tammy, science is not under the umbrella of God/faith/religion, etc. You can make outrageous claims in YOUR faith-based World you inhabit, but when you step into the rational evidence-based World of science you are like a fish out of water which leapt into the frying pan.... Don't make claims of the current status of scientific knowledge unless you're willing to get fileted alive and grilled over your "knowledge".

    Peace be with you!

  • tec
    tec

    LOL... I don't think you have a clue what I am saying, Sol.

    Science and God are not in conflict. Its not a revolutionary statement. Science and religion, sure. But science... truth... God...? How can there be a conflict?

    Peace,

    tammy

  • NewChapter
    NewChapter

    The constant claim that I see is that one day Science will prove God true. Only that is not the concern of science. Science is a study of the natural world, and gods are not part of the natural world. Also, you can be sure that science will make new discoveries, but I often hear it stated with certainty that those new discoveries will prove someone's vision of their particular version of a particular god. CERTAINTY. Well that's the thing about what is not known---nobody can be certain of what will be discovered, because it has not been discovered.

    The fact is, the sky is no limit to what can be guessed at or wished for. A child could insist there was a boogie man in the closet, and in spite of all evidence could still insist and then could fall back on---well it might be discovered one day! And that would be true. It might. I loved reading books about the Borrowers when I was young, and I REALLY wanted them to be real. I knew they weren't, but I could have decided to believe and simply said, 'just cuz no one hasn't seen them yet, they are there. They could be discovered any time." and that too would be true.

    And if you want to believe in a god, you just should. It's religion, it is not science. Science does not concern itself with religion. Religion DOES concern itself with science, and we can see that from the way they have evolved over the years. Which, when you consider they claim to follow a god, the idea that religion redefiines their god for them is quite shocking. But anyway---another thread.

    It should not matter if science one day finds proof of your god. You like your god, go with it. Don't worry about science. It is separate from faith. It is the opposite of faith. Why mix them up? That's really when you get resistance---when you try to coopt science and ask for it to answer a question it had never even asked, nor would it ask. Science is silent on god.

    Now those that read what Science has delivered make up their own minds. Science doesn't care. It is allowed.

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